Ready or not, it’s that time of the political calendar. The presidential campaign, in some ways, officially kicks off tonight with the first GOP debate on Fox News. We know Donald Trump will not be present, but we will hear from the other leading candidates.
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This really is significant back-and-forth here, and it reflects a real debate. So much insincerity early on (Haley has never had to vote on federal budget, so she attacks those who have...Vivek has never served, uh, anywhere, so he attacks those who have), but this is a real debate.
Vivek really testing whether our politics has developed to the point where it will reward a candidate whose political imagination was shaped more through media debate culture than public service.
Yeah. It's... refreshing(?) in a way. New take on how to partake in the debate. Seeing a younger person on stage is kind of exciting. Just not sure the very hard break from certain norms will work in his favor. I'm a bit put off by the attitude.
"Every second we talk about the past (Trump) is a wasted opportunity..." HE IS CURRENTLY BEATING ALL OF YOU IN THE CURRENT CAMPAIGN IN WHICH YOU ARE RUNNING THIS VERY MOMENT
It's a no-win issue for these candidates bc it divides Republicans. Could have been a real debate, as DeSantis tried to say, but yeah, no, just dodging and reframing.
I agree about Hutchinson and Bergum. Hutchinson in particular seems lifeless. Bergum tries to bring a different vibe, but I don't think it's enough to lift him out of the dolldrums.
Not sure about what this will ultimately means for the primary. Trump has an odd stranglehold on the Republican Party. Not sure about what can change that unless Trump is prevented from running.
Haley was great in this debate, I find Vivek’s brand of politics distasteful, but the “career on the boards of Lockheed and Raytheon” line was incredibly clever (I laughed out loud)
Kinda wild that Chris Christie and Mike Pence are trying to team up as the reasonable ones. Shows how dramatically the party has changed. 8 years ago those two would've been considered polar opposites within a R primary, right?
- Bergum and Hutchinson didn't make an impact. Can't see how they hang in the race.
- Pence was a bit annoying/condescending. Lots of interrupting. Lots of "When I was VP..." the "Trump/Pence administration did..."
- DeSantis didn't answer at least two questions and was called out on it. Didn't seem to really know what to do. Most confident when talking about Florida, specifically.
- Scott has a good story, but he didn't do much to stand out. Just had his few moments to speak, but nothing really powerful.
- Christie is coming down as a more 2000's-ish Republican. I get some more John McCain in 2008 vibes from him. Kind of a callback to a more "traditional" conservatism. Not sure if the voting base is wanting to do that.
- Haley impressed with her nuanced answers early on. Later got stuck with some of the snippy arguments, but overall, did well in conveying where she stands.
- Ramaswamy came out at a sprint and didn't stop. Really interesting with his energy and clear cut points. However, he seems like he just wants to steamroll through his vision. Did a lot to alienate not super conservative voters and would make across the aisle work extremely difficult.
- Ramaswamy firmly established himself as the anti-establishment go-getter. Will appeal to people who want a fresh face. Turned off anyone looking for a "wise" voice or a calm presence. Also may turn off people who feel he is cocky rather than confident.
- Haley will appeal to those looking for some nuance. Her stance on abortion may lose the more hardline pro-life crowd.
- Pence and Christie tap into the pro-Constitution crowd. Pence seems more along establishment Republican. Christie appeals to more traditional conservatives. Both may lose support due to not bringing something unique and anti-Trump stances.
- DeSantis didn't lose any support, I don't think, but the only support he may have gained was from people who were disappointed/turned off by Pence/Ramaswamy/Christie. I think Scott is in a similar boat to DeSantis.
- Bergum certainly had a down-home feel with his small town talk. Seems like a nice, down-to-earth guy, but not inspiring.
- Hutchinson didn't do much. Had a couple soundbites calling out Trump, but there was no follow up or anything really interesting from him.
- Trump is still the front-runner unless something drastically changes. I don't see how this debate changes this.
I think so. Both very pro-Constitution. However, Pence might need a younger, more vibrant VP (though not necessarily a Sarah Palin type). There's a balance there.
First question on the economy, featuring several videos including street interviews and the Rich Men North of Richmond song, which received a mention before Donald Trump received a mention.
Good start to this debate with Natalie Grant singing. We had her sing back when I was at The White House, and she is the real deal. A real champion in efforts to combat human trafficking as well.
The point on which the entire GOP primary turns: Is Trump a winner? If GOP primary voters think the answer is yes, then Trump will be the nominee. If serious doubt emerges on this point, then other candidates have a chance.
Let's see tonight how this aspect of the primary plays out.
Yeah. I’m very interested in how this shakes out. Can the primary candidates do enough to stand out to voters tonight, or is Trump’s shadow just too large?
The audience for this might be miniscule and maybe there are basically no swing or persuadable voters paying attention... but I think this would remind a lot of those people why they voted for Biden.
People are super protective about their kids. If they feel their kids' education is being corrupted by "woke" teachers or whatever, that will appeal to conservative parents.
Christie calling out Trump as inappropriate behavior/beneath the office could be a litmus test on how the Republican Party as a whole views that. If his numbers drop precipitately after this, the other candidates won't touch that again.
Clever of the moderators to get the "rule of law", "law and order", and pro-law enforcement rhetoric warmed up just before pivoting to Trump's crimes... 👀😲
Wow. Vivek pointing to issues that Millenials/Gen Z are concerned about, while Pence and the more establishment Republicans want to stick to traditional talking points.
Haley is a pretty remarkably talented politician.
I was not expecting to be impressed by her but I am.
Agreed. Staking out smart, and rather nuanced given the time limits, positions.
Now this is an actual, substantive debate. Maybe the first real policy debate so far, and it's on abortion.
Sounds like we turned the TV off at the wrong moment! Looking forward to y’all’s thoughts tomorrow!
This really is significant back-and-forth here, and it reflects a real debate. So much insincerity early on (Haley has never had to vote on federal budget, so she attacks those who have...Vivek has never served, uh, anywhere, so he attacks those who have), but this is a real debate.
This is the first time I actually feel like I'm getting to know what the candidates stand for and think. This is compelling.
Wow. Really something for Fox News to say definitively that abortion has been a losing issue for Republicans since Dobbs.
Vivek really testing whether our politics has developed to the point where it will reward a candidate whose political imagination was shaped more through media debate culture than public service.
Yeah. It's... refreshing(?) in a way. New take on how to partake in the debate. Seeing a younger person on stage is kind of exciting. Just not sure the very hard break from certain norms will work in his favor. I'm a bit put off by the attitude.
Haley says climate change is real and follows up immediately with critique of Biden to try to avoid getting booed. Pretty effective.
Christie mentions "truth and accountability" in response to a question on the economy. I think we'll hear those words again from him.
Country in decline: Trump, DeSantis, Vivek
Country has great future: Scott, Haley, Pence
DeSantis might be happy trying to hang around in second place, if he can, until the field gets whittled down a bit.
True. Less of a target on his back.
"Every second we talk about the past (Trump) is a wasted opportunity..." HE IS CURRENTLY BEATING ALL OF YOU IN THE CURRENT CAMPAIGN IN WHICH YOU ARE RUNNING THIS VERY MOMENT
Mike Pence is not going to let someone cast a dark vision of America while he's standing right there (unless he's asked to be his running mate)!
Haha! True. Feels very out of touch with younger voters (speaking as a 33-year-old Millenial)
Very interesting for Pence to raise the issue of contrition
American cities are in decline? Is Atlanta the one exception? Am I delusional
Frustrating that no one really answered the Climate Change question. Lots of finger-pointing rather than ownership of the issues.
terribly frustrating
It's a no-win issue for these candidates bc it divides Republicans. Could have been a real debate, as DeSantis tried to say, but yeah, no, just dodging and reframing.
Vivek scares me with his foreign policy ideas. Too insular thinking. We live in a globalized world.
A couple of thoughts at this point:
- This is all good but then I remember that no one on the stage is polling higher than the teens and most single digits.
- I think Hutchinson and Bergum need to drop out unless they have more of a moment before this is over.
Both thoughts are well-put and worthwhile, Sarah.
I agree about Hutchinson and Bergum. Hutchinson in particular seems lifeless. Bergum tries to bring a different vibe, but I don't think it's enough to lift him out of the dolldrums.
Not sure about what this will ultimately means for the primary. Trump has an odd stranglehold on the Republican Party. Not sure about what can change that unless Trump is prevented from running.
Ramaswamy somehow vibe that reminds me of both Trump and Obama.
Who had pocket Constitution on their bingo card?
Haley was great in this debate, I find Vivek’s brand of politics distasteful, but the “career on the boards of Lockheed and Raytheon” line was incredibly clever (I laughed out loud)
Vivek giving all the soundbites.
Christie tapping into the Reagan parallels.
I have to say that Haley and Christie both keep surprising me.
Pocket Constitution finally appears at 40'
ABOUT TIME
You know Haley had that line in her back pocket ready for some point of the evening--and well deployed here, I think!
Turning into a free-for-all...
I won't lie, I'm finding Ramaswamy pretty entertaining!
He does have a unique verve that the others lack. I like the energy, but I don't know if he can balance energy without becoming too cavalier
Definitely--"entertaining" is not the quality that ultimately matters here. But it sure does liven things up!
Surprised with Haley coming in swinging at Republicans too--and receiving some cheers!
me too!
Chris Christie playing sober minded and serious
The Chat GPT line was pretty spectacular
What did you think?
Kinda wild that Chris Christie and Mike Pence are trying to team up as the reasonable ones. Shows how dramatically the party has changed. 8 years ago those two would've been considered polar opposites within a R primary, right?
Amateur assessment:
- Bergum and Hutchinson didn't make an impact. Can't see how they hang in the race.
- Pence was a bit annoying/condescending. Lots of interrupting. Lots of "When I was VP..." the "Trump/Pence administration did..."
- DeSantis didn't answer at least two questions and was called out on it. Didn't seem to really know what to do. Most confident when talking about Florida, specifically.
- Scott has a good story, but he didn't do much to stand out. Just had his few moments to speak, but nothing really powerful.
- Christie is coming down as a more 2000's-ish Republican. I get some more John McCain in 2008 vibes from him. Kind of a callback to a more "traditional" conservatism. Not sure if the voting base is wanting to do that.
- Haley impressed with her nuanced answers early on. Later got stuck with some of the snippy arguments, but overall, did well in conveying where she stands.
- Ramaswamy came out at a sprint and didn't stop. Really interesting with his energy and clear cut points. However, he seems like he just wants to steamroll through his vision. Did a lot to alienate not super conservative voters and would make across the aisle work extremely difficult.
Overall results (in my opinion):
- Ramaswamy firmly established himself as the anti-establishment go-getter. Will appeal to people who want a fresh face. Turned off anyone looking for a "wise" voice or a calm presence. Also may turn off people who feel he is cocky rather than confident.
- Haley will appeal to those looking for some nuance. Her stance on abortion may lose the more hardline pro-life crowd.
- Pence and Christie tap into the pro-Constitution crowd. Pence seems more along establishment Republican. Christie appeals to more traditional conservatives. Both may lose support due to not bringing something unique and anti-Trump stances.
- DeSantis didn't lose any support, I don't think, but the only support he may have gained was from people who were disappointed/turned off by Pence/Ramaswamy/Christie. I think Scott is in a similar boat to DeSantis.
- Bergum certainly had a down-home feel with his small town talk. Seems like a nice, down-to-earth guy, but not inspiring.
- Hutchinson didn't do much. Had a couple soundbites calling out Trump, but there was no follow up or anything really interesting from him.
- Trump is still the front-runner unless something drastically changes. I don't see how this debate changes this.
Burgum's politics are so North Dakota
Would Pence consider Christie as his VP?
I think so. Both very pro-Constitution. However, Pence might need a younger, more vibrant VP (though not necessarily a Sarah Palin type). There's a balance there.
Pence is running like a man who thinks he's just waiting for the electorate to get serious
Vivek is the Buttigieg of this GOP field...discuss
Why do these experienced politicians and debaters let this guy control the flow of the whole debate?
Vivek's whole vibe is just extremely online
EXTREMELY
Republicans haven't traditionally been big supporters of the rhetoric of "revolution," but maybe times are a-changing, Vivek!
Hmmmm...skinny guy with a funny last name. Where have I heard that before?
Ah, Pence is going to try to use references to the Trump Administration to get more time.
First question on the economy, featuring several videos including street interviews and the Rich Men North of Richmond song, which received a mention before Donald Trump received a mention.
Good start to this debate with Natalie Grant singing. We had her sing back when I was at The White House, and she is the real deal. A real champion in efforts to combat human trafficking as well.
Christianity Today asked what I thought should be on Christians' minds as they watch the debate tonight: https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2023/august/2024-gop-republican-debate-abortion.html
The point on which the entire GOP primary turns: Is Trump a winner? If GOP primary voters think the answer is yes, then Trump will be the nominee. If serious doubt emerges on this point, then other candidates have a chance.
Let's see tonight how this aspect of the primary plays out.
Yeah. I’m very interested in how this shakes out. Can the primary candidates do enough to stand out to voters tonight, or is Trump’s shadow just too large?
So do you expect the debate to significantly revolve around Trump or to focus on the issues and deprive Trump of the limelight?
We'll see! My point is more that I'm not sure anything else really matters electorally if that issue isn't addressed.
So far not really addressing Trump at all. Also just a fully stupid debate, anyway, so...
Real test here of who thinks they need to get "rude" and break in to get face time and, like, that's just a terrible test to have in a debate. 🗑️
The audience for this might be miniscule and maybe there are basically no swing or persuadable voters paying attention... but I think this would remind a lot of those people why they voted for Biden.
Yep. Frustrating to say the least.
I thought that was one of the best abortion answers I've heard on a debate stage from Haley
Very impressive and nuanced. I was appreciative of the care given in her wording.
She really spent a lot of time early in the campaign figuring out her approach here. Served her well.
Did Chris Christie just come out as anti-teacher during his answer to a question about UFOs?
At least anti teachers' unions
If he wants to go after labor unions, teachers have gotta be the worst way to do it?
People are super protective about their kids. If they feel their kids' education is being corrupted by "woke" teachers or whatever, that will appeal to conservative parents.
"they were putting themselves before the people"... about _teachers_?
Hutchinson using "insurrection" to describe January 6! Surprising...
Christie calling out Trump as inappropriate behavior/beneath the office could be a litmus test on how the Republican Party as a whole views that. If his numbers drop precipitately after this, the other candidates won't touch that again.
Clever of the moderators to get the "rule of law", "law and order", and pro-law enforcement rhetoric warmed up just before pivoting to Trump's crimes... 👀😲
Hutchinson swinging at Trump undermining rule of law...
Wow. Vivek pointing to issues that Millenials/Gen Z are concerned about, while Pence and the more establishment Republicans want to stick to traditional talking points.